• PiperForum.com is a vibrant community of Piper owners and pilots. Our over 1,500+ active members use Piper Forum to swap technical knowledge, plan meetups and sell planes/parts. We host technical knowledge of general aviation topics and specific topics on J3-Cubs, Cherokees, Comanches, Pacers and more. In addition to an instant community of pilots for you, PiperForum.com is a library of technical topics, airplane builds, images, technical manuals, technical documents and more.

    Access to PiperForum.com is subscription based. Subscriptions are only $19.99/year or $3.99/month to gain access to this great community and unmatched library of Piper knowledge.

    Click Here to Become a Subscribing Member and Access PiperForum.com in Full!

Help with the Value of my 1978 Archer II, getting ready to sell

Gregplatt

Junior Member
Supporting Member
Joined
Mar 20, 2016
Messages
79
Reaction score
11
Hello all,
I have loved my piper archer but i'm getting ready to upgrade planes now and i'm getting my plane ready to sell. I don't think I'm going to use a broker so i'm wondering if i can get peoples opinions of what it's worth for a selling price.

1978 Piper Archer II (taper wing 180hp)
TTAF: 10800
TSMOH: 1981
General Condition
Overall this plane is in great shape, i do anything that's available to do for maintenance. The plane spent some time as a trainer in the middle of it's life and was corporate owned at one time. I purchased it originally to get my PPL and build some time.
Interior is new as of 2018 full genuine leather with new plastics, carpet, side panels, lots of time spent to make it really clean inside.
Newer windshield, side glass
New tires, brakes etc..
All ad's complied, upgraded oil lines etc...
Upgraded front seat belts to am safe shoulder belts that retract 2016
lightweight starter, alternator
Full electric non vacuum setup
Aspen 1000
RC Allen digital display
EI cgr 30-p engine monitor
IFR panel, a little dated but ok, newer ICom radio, apollo gx50 gps, nav com
406 dual frequency elt new 2018

Exterior
Probably 5/10 for paint, it's been repainted in the 90's and touched up as needed, serviceable.
Includes a full set of wheel pants not installed

Highlights
- Pilot and Co-Pilot full articulating seats
- Right at 1000lbs useful load
- Really nice interior
- Lots and lots of Logs and records!
- No vacuum issues, semi glass panel
- No corrosion, originally sold on the west coast and spent most of it's time in dry climate including AZ. I've hangered it since I've owned it and the previous owner did the same.


I'll get some photos soon, really a great little plane. I'm going to something larger and a little more power. I'm 6'8" tall and i fit pretty well in this plane, this was a real issue for me and surprisingly this is a comfortable plane for bigger guys.

I'm just looking for what people think it's worth, i don't have a subscription to Vref, but maybe i should get one. Seem like planes are up in value as of lately

Thanks
Greg
 
Last edited:

killrocks

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 1, 2015
Messages
4,070
Reaction score
1,601
It sounds like a pretty nice plane.


I like to watch the market and it's interesting how various factors affect it. The small airplane market seems pretty sensitive to a host of factors. The general improvement in the economy is driving a suprisingly robust uptick in the market at the moment.



In your case, I suspect you are going to take a couple hits to ideal valuation. You have on paper an engine that is close to being "runout". The more hours SMOH, the greater the potential for something to go south and require an overhaul which is, as I'm sure you know, very spendy.


The real wild card is the AFTT. Over 10,000 hours, plus history as a trainer could potentially be a hit to value in light of the latest wing spar failure on a training plane that FAA and NTSB are currently investigating. Piper does have an inspection regime in the MM where you classify the airplane by useage, and more intense use (training, damage history) requires more frequent spar inspections. I suspect we'll see Eddy current bolt hole inspections on a Service Bulletin soon, if not an AD, with stricter requirements for planes with training history.
 

Gregplatt

Junior Member
Supporting Member
Joined
Mar 20, 2016
Messages
79
Reaction score
11
You are correct, high time air frame and engine will hurt it, but i'm not trying to get top dollar for it. One of the original reasons i liked this plane was that it has been consistently used and maintained never really sitting around. I'm hoping to find someone that will run it on condition, the engine is really strong. I'll probably be around 2050 hours when i sell it because i fly the most in the summer right now. I've been looking into the spar and some sort of inspection right now. When i purchased it we did the behind the tank spar inspection and a very thorough stress inspection. Luckily most of the hours are from loitering during contract flying with fewer landings.

On trade-a-plane and controller the really rough stuff, like 20K hour planes are around $20k to 30K. I'm thinking maybe around $35 to $40k? A $20k engine rebuild would make it pretty nice and someone would be in it pretty good?
 

av8ator1

Junior Member
Supporting Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2017
Messages
633
Reaction score
178
I think the paint, engine time and your airframe time are a drawback but you have plenty of upside. I would say it’s between 35k and 40k.
In great condition, mid time engine, and average total time the airplane is worth 65k to 70k. Factor an engine and paint and the recent hype about trainer aircraft and high hours and I think you will find yourself in the 35k neighborhood.
 

ranchorossa

Supporting Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2011
Messages
165
Reaction score
48
AOPA has a tool called VREF. It will give you an idea of what your plane is worth. I think their numbers are high, just have to watch the market.
 

MN_Flyer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 6, 2015
Messages
140
Reaction score
13
It's worth about $100 and I can pay cash right now if you are ready to sell!

If I was buying the plane, I would assume that I am going to end up putting $25K+ into it immediately for an overhaul, hoses, mounts, installation, etc. It could run a few hundred more hours, but that would be a bonus in my mind.

Sounds like you have put a lot of work into the plane and spared no expense with the Aspen and new interior. Those sorts of things can provide some insight to your potential buyer as to how you have maintained the airframe and all the hidden things.
 

pipster

Doug Ryan, Fake Pilot
Supporting Member
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
297
Reaction score
62
Location
KLZU
With the op's initial description, I instantly came to a figure of $39k.
Man I need to get my head out of this. And I'm not even a pilot. :confused:

I just play one on TV. I'd love to see some photos though. Appearance and smoh time is everything with used planes. I love looking at them!

JMO, ADS-B compliance would be a help to valuation.
 
Last edited:

Gregplatt

Junior Member
Supporting Member
Joined
Mar 20, 2016
Messages
79
Reaction score
11
Here are some photos, i need to work on selling this but i've been really busy. Interior is brand new
IMG_20180830_194234.jpg
IMG_20180830_194043.jpg
IMG_20180830_194028.jpg
IMG_20180830_193903.jpg
IMG_20180830_193655.jpg
IMG_20180821_175635.jpg
IMG_20180821_175604.jpg
IMG_20180821_175512.jpg
IMG_20180821_175502.jpg
IMG_20180821_175400.jpg
IMG_20180821_175345.jpg
 

Gregplatt

Junior Member
Supporting Member
Joined
Mar 20, 2016
Messages
79
Reaction score
11
The plastics are new also, including the entire top ventilation system. New door seals and they are the super nice stc ones. I should have changed the headliner also, not sure why i didn't, it's not to bad though. Runs like a champ, was thinking about an overhaul but i really think you could get at least 300 more hours out of this guy or more, pulls really strong. One nice thing is that the useful load is right at 1000#, i believe 990# or something like that, so you can actually put some people and a bunch of fuel in it. A lot of these archers get heavy, when i was shopping originally i was finding useful loads as low as 800 pounds. I do maintenance with an open checkbook so my annuals are pretty expensive but the plane really doesn't need anything mechanically, and it's not that bad cosmetically. The paint is a little worn, but not that bad. You can really just fly it as is, but if you did some paint and a rebuild you'd have a really nice machine! These pictures were taken before i received the new decal package so they are missing. I've heard that TruTrack works with the aspen now so that would be a pretty easy upgrade also. This plane is really great, i purchased it to get my ppl and add some hours. Now i'm ready to move on to something a little bit more complex, but i keep thinking i'm going to miss this one. The carpet looks dirty in some on the photos, but it's just the picture, the interior only has about 4 hours on it, so it still smells new and looks great. It's genuine leather on the entire seat, no vinyl. This plane originally had A/C also so it may be retrofittable, I'm not sure. I have the original build sheet and it was a pretty loaded plane. It's also surprisingly quite. Also quite roomy, i'm 6'8" 290lbs so i'm what they call BIG, but i fit pretty good. Both the front seats have vertical adjustment. I have some wheel pants that i purchased but never had them installed since they are pretty heavy. I get good cruise speeds out of it without them.
I'm asking $42K for it, that should be a pretty good deal in today's market i believe.
 

Latest posts

Top